THE GROW PODCAST | S1E5 | The Peace of Obedience | Summer Lee | Purpose Driven Coaching & Consulting
Beth 0:01
Beth, welcome to the Grow Podcast. I'm Beth, and I am so excited about today's episode. Now it might seem a little heavy when I tell you the topic, but only at first. I think by the end of this episode, if you stick around, you're going to see this topic differently than when we started. We're talking about obedience, what it looks like in real life, and how it actually will bring more freedom, not less. Now you'regonna hear summer talk about her personal story like she has in every episode. It's so good, she shares how obedience became a turning point for her, not a burden, but a more of a release. This conversation has actually helped me rethink what it means to listen and respond and trust God's direction, not just in small things or just the big things, but in both. Now I really encourage you to stick around and just lean in. We're gonna jump right into the conversation on obedience. Let's get started.
Summer 0:58
Think you know when we talk about this, my mind always goes to being obedient in the small things, and recognizing that when we are God will put bigger and bigger things in front of us to obey. And so when you think about the small things, sometimes it's even just a prompting of, you know, to pray for someone or to shoot a quick text message to check on someone. I remember one day my husband saw a lady walking down the street with a jug of milk, and it was just like eating him alive. He couldn't stand it, you know. And he was like, I just feel like we should pick her up. And I'm like, That's between you and the Holy Spirit. You know, I'm not getting that and I'm not getting I'm not getting that one, but if you're getting that one, yeah, we need to pick her up. And you know, obedience is, is it'sa prompting from the Lord. I mean, my favorite story of obedience was when God spoke the word obedience to Me. I had been struggling a lot with taking my role. Well, let me back up and say this, we understand right, that we work in partnership with God to accomplish things on this earth. My struggle was, what is my role God here in the natural space, and then what is your role? Because I feel like I'm going too far beyond what my role is, and I'm taking away, you know, from what God's role is. In other words, I'm exhausting myself doing too much because I think I'm supposed to. I don't know the line is right. I don't know when I'm supposed to stop and and then just trust, trust God. And it doesn't really work linearly like that. You know, there's it looks different, but my prayer at the time was God like, what is my role in the natural? Because I'm struggling with with where it begins and ends show me, and when I asked that in my prayer, I mean, before I even finished getting the words out, God dropped obedience in my spirit, that my role in the natural is obedience, and I instantly felt so free. So you said, you know freedom and letting go, and that's exactly how I felt. I felt this freedom of, Oh, wow. Obedience isn't like this chore. Obedience is something that frees me from having to figure it all out on my own or having to do it all in my own power, obedience gives me this freedom to simply tune in and listen and to follow and obey God, he will show me the way. I don't have to figure out my own way. It's not all up to me.
Beth 3:58
I love the way your framework talks about obedience, it uses three words, increases, frees and points. And so when you wrap that back around, it increases our spiritual maturity and discernment coming from an overflow of God's love. So each time we are obedient in that, in the small things, it points us closer to the bigger things that God has called us to do. It frees us from striving in our own power, and teaches us to to trust his way over our own way.
Summer 4:35
His way over our own way. That's huge,
Beth 4:36
yeah, and sometimes I think that's where, where I struggle a little bit,and I will come back around to that, but and it also points us towards God's purpose. So the whole thing about your framework is Genesis rhythm like a balanced restorative path back to God's design. And so without grace. And without rest, it's really hard to hear what voice you should be listening to to even know what to obey.
Summer 5:08
Well, I believe that in the past, when I have struggled more with wit that gap, not not saying I never do, but I think the gap has come when I'm not clear that it's God's voice, and as you get better at discerning God's voice, I think that that gap can get smaller and smaller, because when you know it's God's voice, you learn to trust His nature, that his way is better than my way. I think it's easier to walk in that obedience, but I know that in the past, there have been times where maybe I felt that tug, or I felt that nudge, but I didn't know if it was God or if it was me. And so I think, you know, so crucial to kind of what we want to teach about obedience is how to recognize and hear God's voice. And you know, God speaks to us in many ways, and recently, I heard a message that gentleman was talking about how God is speaking to us all the time, but it's hard to tap into that, in to the channel that he might be on, right? I heard, I have to interrupt this with to tell a little bit about a reel I saw from Preston Morrison. He's a pastor in Arizona, and he had another gentleman were talking, and they were like, you kind of get used to I hear God in this way. Maybe it's through His Word, you know, or maybe you're accustomed to hearing his voice. Or maybe there's just maybe you're seeing something and God's showing you things. But sometimes God will switch channels, and we think, where did you go? You know, where did you go? You're not speaking to me anymore, and it's like, No, we're just switched channels. And so sometimes we have to recognize that we God might have switched channels. And I know one time for me that I felt like I was hearing from the Lord a lot myself. And then I went through a season where I felt like the Lord was speaking to me through you a lot. And right now, I feel like I'm hearing from the Lord in a different way. And so I think we always have to be aware of like God is speaking. So how do I get to where I can tune in? And I think that's why the rest and the grace, like you said, is so important, because if I'm not operating from a place of rest, I'm not very likely to either one be able to hear or discern God's voice in two. I certainly probably don't have the capacity, like you said, to obey if I feel like I'm at my wit's end, I am spent. You know, I don't have the capacity to take that on. I don't have time to deal with their problem and pray for them right now. Or I don't have time to take on XYZ, you know, maybe God that you're calling me to, it's hard to obey when we're not operating from a place of rest.
Beth 8:18
Yeah. And I think what I've learned through your your framework for living a lifestyle of grow, and you're walking in obedience, in a rhythm. You can't look at obedience by itself like it doesn't. It doesn'toperate by itself. It's sequential, just like you've taught us, but without that grace and that rest and that obedience, like sometimes the gap is because we have to pause and we have to re renew, whether it's our mind or our body, like we have to have something restored to be able to obey and get back in alignment. But other times, and we talk about this in the next episode, but it's a beautiful segue, because a lot of times that obedience also requires a weight, like it requires something, and it's so interesting. There's a couple of women that I talked to this past week on and all three of them have said the same thing. I don't understand what the delay has been, butI trust it, and these are women that I'm working with, and so it's like it's not about me, but at the same time, I can 1,000% say that sometimes our delay isn't because of us, sometimes our delay has everything to do with the other people he is aligning with. The more we can all begin to proactively live in this rhythm, the more we are going to naturally as an overflow, begin to be obedient a lot quicker. And so these particular women, if I'm called, to be a part of their. Journey, and we have this kingdom partnership, and we're uniquely made, and we're stepping into that purpose together. Therefore that opportunity is not going to someone else, like we're in it. I think, Oh, well, if you got this vision a year ago, but you would have done this year ago. There's no way I could have been a part of it a year ago because I was very sick a year ago, so maybe you were waiting on me coming to the scene. This has been a recurring conversation, and again, it's not about me. The point is, you never know what you're waiting on. Usually, our resistance is the first sign that that gap has to do with us, obviously. But once we fully step into that there may even be what feels like a gap on the other side. And so obedience can look like both sides of the same coin. If that, am I making sense?
Summer 10:49
Absolutely, I think that to obey there has to be such a huge amount of trust.
Beth 10:57
Yes, Trust is the key. It's it's the fuel.
Summer 11:00
It is because if you, if you don't trust that God's way is better than your way, why would you obey? Right? So there has to be this. Well, Imean, let me not say what there has to be for other people. I'll tell you what there is for me. For me, there is such a deep love for God in a clarity on like his nature and who he is, that I fully trust that whatever he has for me, whatever steps he wants me to take, whatever way he wants me To do it, whatever that path looks like, in the end, it would have been exactly what I had chosen, had I known everything that he knows that I don't know, right and and I believe, with everything in my being, that It is the only way to that joy and fulfillment and that peace that only comes from Him. The more I try to do things my way, the more brokenness there is, the more I try to do things with God's way. There's anointing over it. It's just, all I can say is, try it, right? Just try it. And when you experience the difference and how things go, when, when we when we obey, you'll never want to do it your way again. That's right.
Beth 12:38
That's really good, because I know, and this is something that you say, I'll read it from right, from your PDF that I'll put down in the show notes. As he guides, we choose to follow Him and obey. I mean, in that one little sentence, you know it requires that he guides, but for us to know what he's guiding, we have to get to know Him. We have to have that friendship with him. We have to rest under his wing. And I'm not talking about just restorative sleep. I'm talking about like literally learning to rest in a rhythm of rest. Then once he guides, we still have to choose to obey. And so that piece of obedience, I think, for a lot of people listening, or maybe someone listening, you know, they remember what it was like as a child to not obey and to be in trouble. And you know, maybe they have a legalistic view of what disobedience looks like, which prevents them from being able to see the beauty and the freedom and the increase. And basically, obedience is a sign pointing you in a direction of God's perfect will for you. But they can't even see that, because they're so fixated on what the legalistic side of what disobedience looks like. And so they're not so much concerned with being obedient. They're more concerned with creating some loopholes, not to, you know, not to not to be caught for their disobedience, so to speak. But the metric is all wrong, and so until you step back into this rhythm and you realize, hey, I really can't be obedient, even on my best day, with my best intent and my best effort without grace, I can't really rest like really, truly rest and trust without grace, like it all goes back to that starting point of grace. So obedience is such a it's such an important part of your framework. And of just being a leader, you know, we have to be obedient to things all day long, in the sense of, hey, if we don't do this, this is not going to happen. If we don't do this, this is not going to happen, but from your perspective, in this framework, it's it brings it into a place of choice, which is where freedom is, and it if you allow yourself to sit there and really think about that. And I think some people, this is kind of a shorter episode. So. But I think for some people, they're going to need to listen to it twice, because until it really sinks in, that that obedience is not what your parents used to speak to you as a child, like you're going to do, or whatever your history is, obedience allows us to be able to really live through our imagination of what should and could be, and that's what empowers us to step toward into our purpose, you know,
Summer 15:25
and our obedience comes from an overflow of our love for God and His love for us. So you have to think of an example for that, our spouse, you know, I love Jason so much that I want to honor him. I want to do things that are pleasing to Him, right? I want to he'll love if I say I want to obey Him. That will make him laugh.
Beth 16:00
Well, it makes you laugh, or it makes you like, take a step back, like, what? Where you know you whatever your response is to that statement tells you the area that you need to Yeah, through. Does that make sense? Like
Summer 16:13
it's a view of obedience, because I laughed when I said it, but really, I mean, Jason and I are obedient to each other, right? It's not just me to him, it's both of us. We're obedient to each other in that we we honor what the other one asked us to do. We put our full faith and trust in each other to carry out the different roles that we have in our marriage. Is that making sense? Yeah? And then we're Yes, yes, but it comes from a place of love. It doesn't come from a place of duty
Beth 16:46
or obligation or Yeah. And on some days, yeah, you have an obligation to love and honor your wife, but that obligation comes from the love, the overflow, like it all comes back to that grace.
Summer 16:58
Hey, friend, if you've been feeling overwhelmed, out of sync, or just plain tired, I want to invite you into something that could change everything. It's called the Genesis rhythm, a balanced, restorative path back to God's design. It's built around four biblical truths, Grace, rest, obedience and waiting. This isn't a checklist. It's a return to God's intended rhythm. And I'd love to walk this journey with you. You can learn more about the Grow course and discounts for podcast listeners in the show notes below. Now let's get back to the show.
I think we have to talk about the points towards God's purpose. I seewomen struggle a lot with, and probably it's not just women, you know, people who struggle with, I feel like I need to make a change. But I don't know what that is. That could be one element of it, the other element may even be like from a healing perspective, you know, I like right now, I have some things that probably need to be checked out, and I really don't want to go to the doctor and do those things, because I might be afraid of what they tell me, right? But my obedience step is sometimes just going to the going to the doctor, and I think that those steps, if we learn to view those steps, as pointing us towards God's purpose, those obedient steps are pointing us towards God's purpose. Why wouldn't we want to follow them? Because most people wouldn't say, Oh, I don't think most Christians, you know, of course, I want to know what God's purposes for my life and and I want to align with that. And so obedience is the way that we do that.
Beth 18:47
That's really good, yeah
Summer 18:49
Through those steps that we take. I mean, I think I could be wrong, but I think that the the verse that I chose for this one was was one of my favorite verses, and it was like, there'll be a voice behind you, whether the right or the left, right, and saying, This is the way walk in it, and that that's so freeing, you know, to know that, like those gentle whispers, right? They're just behind you and and they're they're pointing you in the direction that is what is best for your life and what God wants for your life. And that changes the whole perspective, I feel like, on obedience. So, like, if you're wondering, how do I know you know what I'm supposed to do? What is God calling me towards? I don't I don't know my role. Well, I think it starts here, you know, with with tuning in to, well, where's God pointing me? And let me take those steps, where is he pointing me? And then when you take a step, he'll point you towards the next step, and then towards the next step. Then I think that's kind of how you how you discern where God's leading you. And am I in alignment with that?
Beth 19:58
I love all of that and the cool. Part about that is even when you step a little bit to the left or a little bit to the right, or you don't get it right, like the promise of God to work all things for good is right there to catch you and it this is just drenched in grace like you, you just cannot look at obedience with any other lens except grace and fully understand the freedom aspect of it and how it actually points back to God's purposes. I've experienced several times, like the Lord is like, go to this doctor or go to that doctor. And I'm like, That makes no sense. I don't want to go to this doctor that's just going to waste my time. But in hindsight, after being healed on several occasions, what I see is like, it builds credibility with your testimony and power to be able to have a testament from the world's perspective of like, hey, here were my numbers, here were my blood tests, here were this that everything pointed to this being wrong, but once God healed me, it's all made right. It's actually become a marker for me, the more outrageous they sound like, like, wait, what?What did I just hear? I need to go do what? And so I've learned to kind of welcome that, you know?
Summer 21:11
I also think that it's, it can be different in different areas of our life, right? There are some areas of our life that we're still hanging on to that we haven't fully surrendered, and it's it's harder to obey in those areas of my life than it is in the areas that I have surrendered. So like, for example, my career was fully surrendered many years ago. And so it's easy for me to step in obedience, even when God tells me to, like, sell my thriving business, you know, and move into something else. It's easy for me to do those things, yet it was hard for me to be willing to have kidney stone surgery, for example, because I had not fully surrendered my body and and you helped me see that, you know that that there was as many things that I hadsurrendered. I mean, the most inferior part of my being, my body, I was still like, hanging on to that and not and had not surrendered that. And so I was still trying to call the shots, and I was still trying to figure out, you know, what, healing looked like for me, instead of following the steps that God was laying out for me so that he could show me what healing looked like. And a great example of that I don't mind sharing is with all my bladder issues for for many years, I had, I mean, I had tried some medications, but I'd always been so resistant to wanting to try any sort of like antidepressant or anti anxiety type medication that would calm the bladder. I just, I'm very anti medicine in a lot of ways, but I I found that when you started taking a medication that was helpful to your bladder. It was so beautiful, how like through your experience, and through what I was going through at the time, because it was really It had become more than my bladder, and my nervous system was completely dysregulated after the kidney stone and when, when God pointed me towards that particular medicine. I had this piece about it. I had such peace that I knew that if I go to the doctor and she suggests something different, my answer is no, like God has only given me peace about this one. And so it was so awesome when I shared with her my story. Here's what's been going on. Of course, she knows me, and here's the medicine that I'm thinking, and she gets this big smile on her face, and she's like, that's exactly what I'm thinking. Like, thank you, God. And it worked beautifully. It quickly, quickly. It was an instantly healing to me, and something that, you know, I just had been so adamant. I'm not, I don't like medicines. I'm not doing this. I'm not doing that. Was the very thing that healed me. But I had to heal. It healed apart. You know, there's, we always have different levels of healing. You know, it heals a lot, but I had to be, I had to get to a place where I trusted God fully with my body, and I had surrendered my body to him. And so I say all of that to say, let me make that really simple, is that if there is an area in your life where you might be struggling with trusting God to obey Him, it's possibly because you're still doing, still hanging on to that control, and that area has not been surrendered.
Beth 24:45
Sometimes we have hard situations in our lives, and we have real pain in our bodies, and so to just nonchalantly say, Oh, just surrenderthat, and the Lord is going to show you, and you're going to hear him, and you're going to obey. I mean. Really that simple, but it's really not that simple at the same time. But I do believe that we can mistake obedience, but it really be a form of control, because our circumstances, our bodies, are screaming at us, the pain is really the only message that we're truly hearing, and we just want it to stop and so our circumstances support that control, but it completely 1,000% leaves God out of it.
Summer 25:31
yeah? And I'll clarify too, that yes, surrender is not a one and done. It's not like, oh, I surrender and now everything just, there's, there's the lit path, you know, surrender. I think I mentioned this one of the other episodes. I've been spending an enormous amount of my prayer time surrendering in detail. And it's an everyday thing. You know, it's coming to me is like you may be struggling with, well, why would I surrender to God? You may be in that place that you you're not in a place where you understand why you would do that at all. And I think you can help me with this. But I think what I would say to that is, I want you to know that. Mean, God loves you so much that's so good. I mean it. He only wants what's best for you. Ultimately, that doesn't mean it's always pretty, it's, it's probably not at all, but he's, he's working everything out for our good, and we are His children. And you know, he is so worthy. And I think the more that I have acknowledged God and recognize like everything that he has done, everything that he continues to do, everything that he will do, that just the way I see him, the easier it becomes to obey when I when I place God in his proper place, and when I have this, I mean, I have such awe and wonder, you know, for who God is, of course, I would surrender, you know, yeah, it's almost like, how could I not voluntary? How could I not but, but I do remember when that was hard? I do remember, you know, before I trusted God enough. So I guess I just wanted to speak to that person and encourage them to pray and to ask God to show them.
Beth 27:33
These are highly successful people. I mean, you, you, you don't stop to think like, How can I slow down. That's not your top mind awareness.
Summer 27:43
I think it's one of the biggest barriers too, to women who are high achieving to get help is there? I don't know when I have time. And what I wanna say to you, if that's your thought process, is this is so important that you don't not have time like you have to make time. You know, it's, it's, it will change your whole life when we replace, and I know we're going to talk about this in another episode, but we were a place, you know, these, these things that you are struggling with. You know, whether that be, you're struggling to slow down, whether that's you're struggling with boundaries, you're overwhelmed, you're not delegating. You know, whatever it is you're you've lost passion for your work, your physical body is suffering. Whatever it is that's going on. What we're discussing here would grow it's God's solution to that. And so
Beth 28:37
I love how you say it's God's solution to that.
Summer 28:40
It's God's solution to these pain points. You know that that we have, he has a solution and but we have to engage, you know, in in that process of healing, my hope is to be a conduit for that,
Beth 28:57
That obedience, I mean, the promise that comes with obedience is an increase. It's the freedom. It frees you. It doesn't obligate you to more. And so there's there are people that currently do not have time to do that. They're going to have to make room for it. They're gonna have to create space for it. They're gonna have to move things around. But there are also people like, within the sound of my voice, that are like, this is their sign. This is their step of obedience. Just to say, hey, I need some help in this area. How can you help me? How can you come and speak to my staff? Like, you know, how? Like, I'm not the one with the issue, but my team is having an issue with time management, or everybody's always so tired or calling in sick. I mean, like something is pointing toward, and that one step of obedience comes with a promise that it's going to give you that nextstep, it's going to open up something that brings increase and freedom to you.
Summer 29:54
So I have to say this, the whole time you were talking, I was just thinking about how we haven't talked about what happens when we obey? Because think about the time that maybe you you ever have, like, just felt like this nudge to pray over someone and you did. How blessed were you in the process, you know, like, Oh my gosh. So have tools, yeah. I mean, it's, it's so beautiful when we, when we allow God to use us, because that's what that's all obedience is, right? We're allowing God to use us for His purpose, and we allow him to do that, it blesses the fire out of us. Our joy comes from that, you know, like it just there's energized.
Beth 30:42
So, so good. Oh, my God.
Summer 30:44
So I just have we can't, you know, leave this, this episode without justreminding you that this, it's not just something you do for God's benefit. God will bless you beyond your wildest imaginations, like when you take those steps of faith, those those those leaps of trust. I have seen God do such amazing things because of my obedience, and I know that he will for y ou too.
Beth 31:16
Okay, I don't know about you, but this episode stirred something deep inside of me, the reminder that obedience isn't about control, it's about trust. I mean, come on, sometimes the smallest chefs can open the biggest doors. This is so good summer said it so perfectly. Obedience frees us, it increases our discernment, and it points us toward God's purpose. For us when we really start to believe that obedience stops feeling like pressure, and it starts to feel like true peace. Next episode, we're gonna be talking about waiting. So if you've been in a season that feels slow, uncertain, or you're waiting for something, you're gonna wanna be here for that so tune in, invite a friend, share this episode, sign up for emails. Everything is down in the show notes, and we cannot wait to see you on the next episode. You.
